New lightweight stop tail on my 335

[7whiskeycharley]

Over the decades, I have heard just about as many folks swear by improving their tone with an aluminum stop-bar as I have swear the same for a brass or steel stop-bar.
I'm not convinced they're either onto anything - and my Sheri sounds too good with its original pot-metal tailpiece for me to bother experimenting.
But, I'm glad it worked well for you.

Well, I'm not here to "convince" anyone of anything. I'm not trying to sell anyone on anything, I'm just sharing my experiences with those that are interested. Draw your own conclusions.

I don't believe there are hard and fast rules that one material or another improves the tone of one type of guitar while another material improves the tone of a different guitar. There are WAY too many variables for that,, including individual taste. What I do believe though is that each of these materials have some unique tonal characteristics that can accentuate or manipulate a guitars tone to some degree. I think I have brightened up 2 dark and dead sounding guitars with aluminum. I also believe that I have warmed or softened a couple of overly bright, harsh sounding Fender (one tele, one strat) guitars with brass. I even believe that ordinary zinc sounds good in other guitars. Aluminum didn't sound the best to my ear on every guitar I tried it on.. The one thing I am personally certain of though is that there is a difference in the tone of each of these materials... Make of it what you will...

 

[Cozmik Cowboy]

Well, I'm not here to "convince" anyone of anything. I'm not trying to sell anyone on anything, I'm just sharing my experiences with those that are interested. Draw your own conclusions.

I don't believe there are hard and fast rules that one material or another improves the tone of one type of guitar while another material improves the tone of a different guitar. There are WAY too many variables for that,, including individual taste. What I do believe though is that each of these materials have some unique tonal characteristics that can accentuate or manipulate a guitars tone to some degree. I think I have brightened up 2 dark and dead sounding guitars with aluminum. I also believe that I have warmed or softened a couple of overly bright, harsh sounding Fender (one tele, one strat) guitars with brass. I even believe that ordinary zinc sounds good in other guitars. Aluminum didn't sound the best to my ear on every guitar I tried it on.. The one thing I am personally certain of though is that there is a difference in the tone of each of these materials... Make of it what you will...

That's interesting, as the conventional wisdom is that harder material = brighter tone, and thus tyour results are the opposite of what one would expect. But I just can't see something outside the speaking length having effect either way.
But again, whatever works for you is fine with me (except things like _converting P-90 LPs tp lesser p/ups, putting humbuckers in Teles, & such, of course; some things are Just Wrong...... )

 

[7whiskeycharley]

Good or bad,, I don't think I'm breaking with convention at all. In both of the Fender examples I went from steel saddles to brass. Brass is considered "warmer" sounding by comparison and is certainly softer. When it comes to brass, aluminum and zinc brass is a
little harder but there are so many different alloys of them all that the lines get blurred.. Besides, hardness isn't all of the puzzle, weight is an important factor as well...

 

[59ersMyYear]

Sheraton fan here too; both the 'ole "Samick" Korean version & the "II Pro" Chinese version which I recently updated to.
I have 2 new Epi's now, the 59 LP being the otther,
& they are impressive. And the prices are wallet friendly

 

[7whiskeycharley]

One other thing that I'll mention, I have LOTS of guitar parts and hardware off of various guitars of all different types. All of them are in zip lock bags and labeled by what they are or what they came off of. One of these bags is a bag of old stop tailpieces, most of which where taken off of inexpensive guitars that I've worked on.. The tailpiece that I took off of my "Inspired by Gibson" 335 was by far the deadest sounding hunk of metal when drop tested on my work bench of any tail piece in the whole bag. This includes several tailpieces I've gotten off of cheap Firefly guitars and the like...

 

[barryflan]

Sheraton fan here too; both the 'ole "Samick" Korean version & the "II Pro" Chinese version which I recently updated to.

There are only two types of people: Sheraton fans, and those who haven't owned one

 

[Raiyn]

There are only two types of people: Sheraton fans, and those who haven't owned one

No, there's three:
• Fans.
• Those who haven't owned one.
• Those who obsess over them and trawl forums looking for Sheraton and Sheraton adjacent content.

 

[soulman969]

Over the decades, I have heard just about as many folks swear by improving their tone with an aluminum stop-bar as I have swear the same for a brass or steel stop-bar.
I'm not convinced they're either onto anything - and my Sheri sounds too good with its original pot-metal tailpiece for me to bother experimenting.
But, I'm glad it worked well for you.

I'll ad me dos centavos to what 7WC experienced with his conversion to the same one I'll be trying. Not that two opinions are in any way a majority but it's 100% more opinion than one.

 

[soulman969]

Sheraton fan here too; both the 'ole "Samick" Korean version & the "II Pro" Chinese version which I recently updated to.
I have 2 new Epi's now, the 59 LP being the otther,
& they are impressive. And the prices are wallet friendly

Welcome to the Epi Forum. Once upon a time I had a very nice Sheraton and sold it It's one more thing I store in my "things I wish I had not done" file.

 

[soulman969]

No, there's three:
• Fans.
• Those who haven't owned one.
• Those who obsess over them and trawl forums looking for Sheraton and Sheraton adjacent content.

Subtle as a bull rhino. Why not just say what you mean. This is an Epiphone Forum so why wouldn't someone come here to talk about Sheratons? You want we should redirect them to TalkBass?

 

[Cozmik Cowboy]

There are only two types of people: Sheraton fans, and those who haven't owned one

Actually, I was both at once; I got my '92 because I loved my bud's '88, so for 4 years, I was Sheriless Sheri fan.

 

[Raiyn]

Subtle as a bull rhino. Why not just say what you mean. This is an Epiphone Forum so why wouldn't someone come here to talk about Sheratons? You want we should redirect them to TalkBass?

There was no attempt to be subtle. I said what I said, and I meant what I said.

There was a guy here, whom I haven't seen for a while, who's whole deal was Sherris and would try to steer conversations towards them - wouldn't discuss anything else. All Sherri, all the time.

It damn sure wasn't a shot @barryflan , he posts about other stuff which is cool.

It also wasn't directed at anyone who is currently active, but the old guys will probably figure out who.

Sheratons are cool and all but there are other guitars and topics.

 

[Noodling Guitars]

I don't believe there are hard and fast rules that one material or another improves the tone of one type of guitar while another material improves the tone of a different guitar. There are WAY too many variables for that,, including individual taste. What I do believe though is that each of these materials have some unique tonal characteristics that can accentuate or manipulate a guitars tone to some degree.

That's the beauty of it, sometimes the magic just happens. It just gets messy when guitarists try to apply their "weird science" to explain the effects. Not to be too disparaging, but a lot of the time those "scientific results" they refer to are not that scientific at all because the premise is completely wrong to begin with - but why do the results work? Because there are other factors involved. Particularly for guitars, a lot of these parts, no matter how "precise" or well-made the parts are, we're not talking microns and tight tolerances here... (The installation sometimes also throws all that out the door too )

At the end of the day, if someone can get the tone they want, that's all that matters.

 

[soulman969]

There was no attempt to be subtle. I said what I said, and I meant what I said.

There was a guy here, whom I haven't seen for a while, who's whole deal was Sherris and would try to steer conversations towards them - wouldn't discuss anything else. All Sherri, all the time.

It damn sure wasn't a shot @barryflan , he posts about other stuff which is cool.

It also wasn't directed at anyone who is currently active, but the old guys will probably figure out who.

Sheratons are cool and all but there are other guitars and topics.

Well OK then. Seemed like it was based solely on timing.

If that other guy comes back we'll just give him his own section OK. We can even use your title......"All Sherri, All The Time". I'll even make sure you get a royalty interest per post.

(Headline; "Raiyn spams Sheraton Thread Section daily")

 

[pontaeri]

I'm kinda lol at the sherri guy, reminds me of the TALKBASS forums where the die hard fender guys always try to take to recommended modern tone threads to Fender P or J and bassman is all you need. Most average audience wouldn't know but certain amps drive sound better with actives than the vintage inspired PUPs, but vintage PUPS do work with valve / tubes (however I do luv that traditional fender thump for that warm 70's groove )

My take is if hardware is solid and doesn't rattle or have weird buzzes or rattles, it'll work for me. stock epi and gibson hardware. one of my 335';s has string wrap on stock, it like the look and haptic feedback when I rest my hand on the bridge for the mutes. But I am of the school that biggest tone if is pickup and electronics swap, amp, and speakers / cabinet. Check out Jim Lill for his guitar tone series. Yes I do believe that hardware (tuners, saddles etc) affects tone, but it's more towards the smaller / finer part . . . better to dial in the big / major (pick up, e-lectronics, amp, speakers / cab) changes first. It's like a initial guitar set up, first you select the string guage + put the string gauge you want, then do the rest.

On acoustics . . .
My bf is into resonators, and metal resonators I can hear a diff between steel and bell bronze / brass. Brass / bell bronze sounds similar (as does german silver), I prefer bell / bell bronze as it has the soothing, warm edge to the tone (stainless steel is brighter, tin like ).

About acoustics whole new dimensions but . . . tone . . . one thing stands out was the tusq vs bone. We were up in Canada and touring this small luthiery run by French builder and I remember our guitarist asking how come he uses tusq by default . . . how he took some bone saddle blanks and tusq, and he dropped them. The better bones had a ping, but the tusq just rang. Like almost a metallic ring to them compared to bone. He laughed to himself. And spoke. The shop manger and inventory guy then translated and it was that tusq carries vibrations more reliably than bone and bone varies and something about spendting time picking out the best bone blanks when tusq works and more time could be spent on building. His acoustics were amazing too, had that well made piano clarity of notes, even in chords. I didn't think much but when Collins said they got their wood from him, and he's the guy that selects the highest grade of spruce in Canada for his team and requests by the top acoustic luthiers not just there but also US and Europe, I'd realized that guy knew what he was doing.